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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
5997
|
Posted - 2014.05.12 16:25:00 -
[1] - Quote
And we have identified yet another one of Jester's butt puppets.
I motion that we make linking his blog grounds for locking a thread. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6003
|
Posted - 2014.05.12 17:05:00 -
[2] - Quote
Prince Kobol wrote:Guttripper wrote:From what I have seen of the "younger" generation at work, unless you can play Eve on a smart phone, this game is too damned old to be bothered with... Yes that would explain the 25mil+ daily players who play League of Legends on their smart phones.... wait a minute
It actually explains that fairly well, given what a complete toilet that game is.
If that's what EVE has to become to get "mainstream" appeal, I say no thank you. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6011
|
Posted - 2014.05.12 21:33:00 -
[3] - Quote
Malcolm Shinhwa wrote:Dave Stark wrote: also, i think downtown detroit and crack houses are massively interesting places; just not interesting enough to risk my life for. so a risk free version of that sounds ideal, really. they have a certain je ne sais quois.
As soon as I learn how to respawn, I'd be happy to go on that raid.
Of course. Why do you think television shows like Breaking Bad and Dexter become so crazypopular anyway?
It's because that kind of thing is what people want. Same reason why anybody would play Dungeons and Dragons, so they can play pretend in a safe environment.
And if people think "Detroit, the RPG" isn't a thing, look up Shadowrun. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6016
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 00:47:00 -
[4] - Quote
Adunh Slavy wrote: Bubble wrap new players
Nope.
Bubble wrapping new players just makes the inevitable fall all the harder. The drop off will still be there. It's also thoroughly open to abuse by veterans, so you're running into Malcanis' Law into the bargain.
[edit: Oh, and what you're describing already exists. They're called NPC corps. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6016
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 01:35:00 -
[5] - Quote
rswfire wrote: New players need people to reach out to them in helpful ways. Not scam them or cause them distress. They need time to acclimate to Eve. I think a lot of people forget this.
Why do you think I go to the trouble of stamping out highsec corps? The less "you can't" a new player hears from all these people, the better the game is overall. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6019
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 01:46:00 -
[6] - Quote
rswfire wrote: Well, I'm not one of those people that says "you can't." I don't personally know anyone who says this. I've only ever seen it said in the forums as anecdotal evidence. (Not saying it doesn't really happen.)
Heck, that's pretty much one of my only criteria for choosing an awox target. If I pretend to be a new player and the first damned thing these people tell me is that I need to mine for 2 months before I can start training to fly fun ships, then the claws come out.
So yeah, believe me, as someone who spends a LOT of time pretending to be a new player, people do say "you can't". A lot. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6025
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 11:54:00 -
[7] - Quote
Barbelo Valentinian wrote:The thing is, it's all very well to pat ourselves on the back and go all self-congratulatorily Darwinian on the problem, but that doesn't help CCP very much.
And that depends entirely on whether you think it's actually a problem. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6034
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 12:44:00 -
[8] - Quote
Tare Bloodraven wrote: There are still overpower issues that CCP has created such as with TECH 1 destroyers and Hulks
Your entire post is you bitching about how skill requirements hold you back... And then you complain about one of the few kinds of ships that new players can actually use to be effective?
You carebears don't even try to make sense, do you? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6034
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 12:55:00 -
[9] - Quote
dalishah11 wrote:Eve makes newcomers feel extremely insecure and difficult learning curve... At the end of the day it is a game not life! Though I feel a very simple solution can make new people stay. Just create a safe zone from pirates let's say of 10 solar systems where new commers feel no threat and learn the game according to their own pace. When I started I had to learn to be safe.... Faster than I could learn or wanted to learn.... This factor made a lot my friends leave.... Eve should be a gaming experience... Not like what a friend of mine said when he left..... It felt like I joined the army!....
Rookie systems already exist. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6038
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 13:08:00 -
[10] - Quote
Tare Bloodraven wrote: Tech I destroyers are for killing Tech 1 frigates LOL
No, they're not. They're for dealing a large amount of DPS in a vulnerable platform.
You know, killing miners.
But since you're asking for a Hulk to isk tank them, and crying about how a 10 mil ship can kill a 200 mil one, yeah, you're being a carebear. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
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Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6041
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 13:21:00 -
[11] - Quote
Tare Bloodraven wrote: Incase you missed what CCP did they took they completely reversed the exhumer line, they took the GIMP single gun and made it a BS tank and took the Mack and gave it a huge ore hold and soso tank but gave the Hulk nothing.....
If you want ISK to ISK I am sure the freighters getting ganked in Niarja by swarms of destroyers would love that discussion.
Grr, ship rebalancing. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6046
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 13:40:00 -
[12] - Quote
Caleb Seremshur wrote:Star wars isn't about spaceships its about taking knights&wizards and extrapolating them in to a scifi environment
You forgot also transposing the plotlines of several Samurai and spaghetti western movies into a sci fi setting. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6059
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 17:00:00 -
[13] - Quote
Organic Lager wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Tare Bloodraven wrote: Tech I destroyers are for killing Tech 1 frigates LOL
No, they're not. They're for dealing a large amount of DPS in a vulnerable platform. You know, killing miners. But since you're asking for a Hulk to isk tank them, and crying about how a 10 mil ship can kill a 200 mil one, yeah, you're being a carebear. How do you not see an issue with this? You shouldn't fly a valuable paper tanked mining boat or I'm going to blow you up in my valueless paper tanked dessy. This causes an unbalance of one side putting far less on the line then the other and a situation of the pot calling the kettle black. Nothing will drive a new player away faster then feeling cheated or being unable to play.
Yeah, turns out a non combat ship loses a fight to a combat ship.
I see no issue with that. No matter what their pricetags are.
Oh, and that's not unbalanced, by the way. In fact it would almost be the definition of good game balance, because their arbitrary pricetag does not determine the winner, but rather which pilot fits and flies better. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6059
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 17:05:00 -
[14] - Quote
Victoria Sin wrote:Jenn aSide wrote: 3 letters. M....M......O
Quite meaningless in my opinion. There's no actual content in the game, even for groups of players. There's a meta, there's player created content, but that's not accessible in any meaningful way to noobs. There are no "epic arcs" that aren't epic purely in the amount of text you have to read to understand the plot. CCP have all of the tools available to make a game with real content inside the Eve universe, but they just refuse to unlock that goddammed door. Funnily enough single player games like the X series have a similar problem here. The campaign is terrible. You're supposed to have fun in the sand box. Can you imagine a movie director cutting up a load of film frames, throwing them up into the air and saying, "here, go and make an epic movie". Games are supposed to be entertainment and relaxation, not work. Eve is often the latter. This is what happens when you don't invest in PvE content. To do it right you need story writers, narrators, voice actors, all of that kind of stuff. The only voices I hear in Eve are my comrades (varying in quality) and "Docking Request Accepted".
Every time I see you post, it's quite apparent to me that not only do you fail to understand the concept of a sandbox game, but that you dislike the concept of a sandbox game.
So get the **** out of EVE, and stop trying to turn my game into the same lowest common denominator garbage that every other game already is. I like sandboxes, I like player content, and I HATE the things you're suggesting, and the kind of "players" you're suggesting it for.
Stop moaning about "Oh, if they only invested million of dollars in voice actors!", and go play a game with that kind of crap in it. TOR prided itself on it's voice acting, go play that. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6061
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 17:07:00 -
[15] - Quote
Talon SilverHawk wrote:Dave Stark wrote:Talon SilverHawk wrote:Eve does need new PvE if not more and less griefing thinly disguised as being part of the game... the latter alone would make the game alot more popular...
Tal
so what you're saying is it needs more of the boring bits, and less of the interesting bits? If you call griefing interesting, which would then cause me to question you as a human being then yes, also adding new PvE content doesn't mean you have to remove anything else from the game, and interesting is in the eye of the beholder.
Developing PVE content to the degree that you people seem to want does, in fact, hurt the rest of EVE. It takes away from badly needed development for things in the game that are actually worth a damn. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6065
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 18:26:00 -
[16] - Quote
Prince Kobol wrote:Also.. didn't realise you were such a special snowflake that CCP should only develop the game for yourself. I mean god... you people
Nothing of the sort.
What I'm talking about is that it's a complete, utter waste of time adding more missions, or whatever, when Sov is still broken, when the POS system is still broken, before the ships are rebalanced, etc.
There are a hell of a lot of things in this game that need fixed first, but apparently if Ripard Teg gets his man panties in a twist about new player retention in a game he doesn't even play anymore (for the themepark crapshoot Elder Scrolls no less), we're supposed to drop everything for that? Hell no. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6065
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 18:40:00 -
[17] - Quote
Prince Kobol wrote: To say they shouldn't spend any time at all just because it may not effect you is you being a special snowflake.
I didn't say that, either. Don't make stuff up.
Quote: To say that they should just ignore everything else until z, x or z is fixed is well.. ridiculous.
Suggesting that some of the largest, most glaringly painful problems of the game be fixed as a priority is not ridiculous. And suggesting that such things take precedent before "PVE is boring" is not ridiculous either.
Guess what, shooting at an AI is always going to be boring. When they added the Sleeper AI all the people in your camp were cheering hooray that PvE was getting an update. And oh look, now it's mapped out on EVE Survival and it can be number crunched, marginalized, and farmed, just like every PVE interaction in every other game.
If you want smart AI and a meaningful PVE experience, an MMO is not the place to find it. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6069
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 18:51:00 -
[18] - Quote
Tux Gallant wrote: I watched a panel on youtube and the game designers said this.
'AI being easy for players is actually a myth. Its rather hard to make AI such that players actually have a chance to win'
In other words, AI could prove to be more of a competitive challenge then other players if developers wanted to invest the energy.
*sigh*
Yay for youtube experts. I'm guessing they were talking about a shooter or a 4x? Because that's not how scripted interaction protocols work for this kind of videogame.
In a game which the AI could conceivably screenwatch you, yes, it would make sense that AI is a balancing act, they have to keep it from knowing what the rest of the program knows, etc. So it doesn't "cheat", like early AI programs were wont to do to simulate actual difficulty. In the first few Command and Conquer games, for instance, the AI can see all of your stuff.
But EVE's AI is about as simple as "If something shoots me, I try to shoot it back!"
But as for "invest the energy", it's not a matter of that. Smart AI already exists, but thanks to technical limitations even in a single player game they are limited in number of how many appear on the screen at once. This is because they use up more computing interactions than stupid AI does.
In an MMO, this is even more critical, as you aren't just talking about computations between a single user and an interface, but dozens of thousands of concurrent users.
So when you're asking for better PVE, what you're actually asking for is more lag. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6070
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 19:06:00 -
[19] - Quote
Veld San wrote: Compare with other games where it takes between 1 month to 3 months at casual pace to reach the endgame.
You are literally saying that EVE having more longevity of content is a bad thing.
Simply baffling. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6076
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 19:16:00 -
[20] - Quote
Veld San wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Veld San wrote: Compare with other games where it takes between 1 month to 3 months at casual pace to reach the endgame.
You are literally saying that EVE having more longevity of content is a bad thing. Simply baffling. Reaching the endgame and staying with it long term are different things, 1 adresses new player mechanics, the otehr adresses quality and quantity of content itself. again, see other more successful games since you are so baffled.
The mere fact that you think there is an endgame in a sandbox game... "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
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Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6076
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 19:23:00 -
[21] - Quote
Tux Gallant wrote: It was a panel of game developers so yeah I think they might know what they are talking about.
Flappy Bird doesn't count. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6079
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 19:30:00 -
[22] - Quote
Tux Gallant wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Tux Gallant wrote: It was a panel of game developers so yeah I think they might know what they are talking about.
Flappy Bird doesn't count. assumptions like this is why AI is more intelligent then humans
And saying "The guys on Youtube said so, so there!" and ignoring every other point I made just shows that you had no real argument in the first place, and are probably making it up.
I graciously accept your surrender.
Am I not merciful? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6081
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 19:45:00 -
[23] - Quote
Tux Gallant wrote: lol...that was high class lame.
like i said,. this is clearly why AI can kick our ass if the devs so desired it.
Of course the AI can kill us if the devs want it to. All they have to do is make it immune to damage, auto jam, and blap you automatically.
Just like CONCORD.
That doesn't mean it's a challenge, or that AI is smart. It just means that it's theoretically possible to give it really overpowered in game stats.
Duh. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6082
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 19:55:00 -
[24] - Quote
Erufen Rito wrote: It's easy to give AI a way to screw us over without making it a 2nd Concord. Make them self rep. Make them remote rep. Make them primary high DPS or logi, instead of randomly switching. Make them change their primaries more often, to put preasure on logi cap and self cap. Make them gain transversal. Make them find soft targets and alpha them off the field.
Right now, they will orbit whatever they are shooting and that's that. Not much of a challenge.
Incursion rats do most of those things.
And people still have number crunched that down into being farmed en masse.
PVE is not a challenge, it's a formula. Once the formula is figured out, it's just a gear check, pardon the phrasing. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6082
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 19:57:00 -
[25] - Quote
Tux Gallant wrote:Within controlled parameters AI is much more intelligent then many people are aware. For example a experiment was done where images where flashed very quickly in front of a screen and the human user was to identify if the image was human or animal. The AI won every time. understand that the AI didnt know the images ahead of time it basically used its AI to determine if a shape was more likely human or animal.
And like I said before, the kind of computing power you need to dedicate before a computer opponent becomes smart is simply not possible to do on an MMO scale.
So you're just asking for lag.
Oh, and no duh an AI can identify shapes and patterns faster on a scroll through test. It can read a flip book too, doesn't mean it's intelligent. You're confusing being good at rote memorization with actual intelligence. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6082
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 20:02:00 -
[26] - Quote
Tux Gallant wrote: hmm yes it is...controlled parameter intelligence test. would you like to take it up with the scientists?
No, numbskull, a pattern recognition test is not a genuine intelligence test.
It is... *drumroll*... a pattern recognition test!
The two are not the same.
So I'm not taking it up with the scientists, I'm taking up with the guy who is too dense to realize the difference. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6082
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 20:04:00 -
[27] - Quote
Tux Gallant wrote: I will be sure to tell the devs of Flappy Birds that what they explicitly said is false then.
You do that. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6083
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 20:10:00 -
[28] - Quote
Erufen Rito wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Erufen Rito wrote: It's easy to give AI a way to screw us over without making it a 2nd Concord. Make them self rep. Make them remote rep. Make them primary high DPS or logi, instead of randomly switching. Make them change their primaries more often, to put preasure on logi cap and self cap. Make them gain transversal. Make them find soft targets and alpha them off the field.
Right now, they will orbit whatever they are shooting and that's that. Not much of a challenge.
Incursion rats do most of those things. And people still have number crunched that down into being farmed en masse. PVE is not a challenge, it's a formula. Once the formula is figured out, it's just a gear check, pardon the phrasing. I've never seen an incursion rat pull transversal on me on purpose. I've never run an incursion fleet that REQUIRED for the logi to be cripled to become doable. There is a difference between efficiency and ability to finish. I've never once seen an incursion fleet alpha soft ships when the rest of the players are on the ball. Incidentally, I have been volleyed off the grid by players, even when my logi was on the ball. Incursions are a bad example to use, because the DPS they dish out vs the ammount of ships is not proportional to the size of the fleet they are expected to face. I am saying incursions are too easy. They were easy when they came out, and they are easy now.
There are only a couple of examples in the game of rats that have pocket reps. One of them is notably in the Angel Epic Arc.
This is because, much like with all the bleating and crying we get about reps in wardecs, it's actually pretty not fun to have to fight through the other guy's health bar going back to full out of nowhere.
So, you want PVE to be much more nofun, got it.
Anything else? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6083
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 20:13:00 -
[29] - Quote
Tux Gallant wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Tux Gallant wrote: I will be sure to tell the devs of Flappy Birds that what they explicitly said is false then.
You do that. somewhat related article http://www.edge-online.com/news/unreal-bots-beat-turing-test-ai-players-are-officially-more-human-than-humans/I also like the story of the marketing program that identified that a shopper was pregnant before she did simply by the purchasing patterns. Some things we are very good at and computers have a hard time with (like walking) other things they are far better than we are. like carrying the entire human knowledge of human behavior on a disk smaller than my d...
Try reading the article you just linked.
The actual Turing Test remains unbeaten.
Secondly, those bots got a "human rating" of 52%. Grats? You just proved yourself ineffably wrong.
Thirdly, aimbots aim better than people. Cheating the game rules does not equal intelligence. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6087
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 20:21:00 -
[30] - Quote
Erufen Rito wrote: Uh, yeah. Learn to logi, because "out of nowhere" is far, far off the mark.
I suppose you didn't read what I wrote.
Neutral reps come from a character with no affiliation to the war target. That's the whole point.
Quote: I want PVE that tosses curve balls varied enough to not become a pattern. It's easy to do. Pokemon did it back whenver it launched.
No, it did not. Pok+¬mon was beyond easy.
You will never get that in EVE, either. They shoot, or they don't shoot. They rep, or they don't rep. They can't use Amnesia to boost their SP stat before they cast Blizzard, they are incredibly binary, stupid bots. This is by necessity, so that something as inarguably unimportant as freaking PVE doesn't cause server lag.
If you want something else, play a different game. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
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Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6089
|
Posted - 2014.05.13 20:41:00 -
[31] - Quote
Erufen Rito wrote: Neutral logi gets a flag now, so it is no longer neutral. Unless they changed this again. Not like it matters, since it only applies to hisec anyway.
It is kind of cute how you are deliberatedly missing my point here, and calling out such a terrible combo to use for your Magikarp.
Not Magikarp, Snorlax. That was the move combo that got it banned from competitive play after the first National Pok+¬mon League tournament.
Quote: Pokemon wasn't easy.
It was if you weren't 12, yeah. Now, Dragon Warrior 2, Original Edition? That game was rough. There are at least 2 points where you can permanently lose the game, and it was pretty open world, so you could wander into a high level zone pretty damn easily and get wiped out for lulz.
Quote:Sure you could whipe out, rage, toss the gameboy, have the batteries fall off, rage some more because you last saved 2 towns back, and carry on. It requried you to think a bit outside of the box, because of all the meta behind it. I wont school you on it, but find about EVs and IVs and stuff.
Ok, let me school you on it instead.
That game was ****ing easy. Especially if you figured out that critical hits bypassed most elemental resistances, so Venusaur (which I nicknamed Peenusaur) could be easily used to clear 4/5ths of the entire game.
Quote: You will end up massaging your brain with EFT after a few pages. Argue whatever you want, it wasn't seen often. And I guess I should've gone with a less over the top aproach. Programing attack patterns that are effective is not hard whatsoever. You just need to have a set of somethings that work, designed to **** on our cherios.
Are you that scared of losing your shiny incursion ship? I mean, you are behemintly opposing a raise in difficulty for your isk faucets. Sounds to me like it is you who needs to try a different, safer game. I heard Star Citizen will respawn your ships if you play on career mode or whatever it's called. I'm sure that will tickle your fancy.
Thanks for your sound advice, I mean playing a different game is not something us eve players do from time to time.
What "attack patterns"? The rats either shoot back or they don't. It's binary.
I'm not opposed to raising the bar, that'd be fine. I'm opposed to wasting time with something that will be math hammered into being marginalized in weeks, when they could be using that dev time to fix real issues. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6133
|
Posted - 2014.05.14 12:44:00 -
[32] - Quote
Has... has his argument really come down to "Ea is more popular and they never stop advertising!"?
While those are technically true, they also lay claim to some of the most obnoxious playerbases in existence, and everyone hates them.
They are a great example of selling your soul and your integrity for mainstream popularity.
What they are not, is an example any game company should follow. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6374
|
Posted - 2014.05.19 13:42:00 -
[33] - Quote
epicurus ataraxia wrote: Now that I agree with. This is a game full of possibilities, it is not a zero sum game of PvP OR PvE, However ALL playstyles have value and deserve respect.
Oh, this should be good. Let me see if I can find it, pretty sure I have a quote of you somewhere that says awoxers should all be banned from the game.
Might have been deleted though, like about three hundred of your other posts.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6395
|
Posted - 2014.05.19 18:10:00 -
[34] - Quote
DrSmegma wrote: This isn't about "refuting". You can't keep players by "refuting" their points. That's why people don't stick. If CCP had surveys, they'd show that. But the lack of surveys already shows the next issue that caused all 3 of the previous ones: CCP don't give a **** about player retention.
You know something? If they are the kind of "player" who won't tolerate being "refuted" (also known as being called out when they are bullshitting), then I don't want them in EVE.
In fact I make it my business to actively chase such people away. So if you come into my game 2 hours old and start spouting off about how things should be? You and your mediocre opinion can go jump in a lake. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6395
|
Posted - 2014.05.19 18:12:00 -
[35] - Quote
Talon SilverHawk wrote: No it isn't fine, PVE hasn't changed in 10 years with hardly any new content, and your dumb arse comment about how most gamers are to crap is ridiculous to the extreme and destroys any sane argument you may have (and you don't have many of those)
You are the prime example of why Eve isn't more popular, insulting ppl that don't share your point of view, whom you've never met or interacted with.
Tal
No duh shooting red crosses hasn't changed much in ten years. Turns out no matter how much you tinker with it, it's still shooting red crosses.
Why would they bother with that? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6397
|
Posted - 2014.05.19 18:22:00 -
[36] - Quote
DrSmegma wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote: You know something? If they are the kind of "player" who won't tolerate being "refuted" (also known as being called out when they are bullshitting), then I don't want them in EVE.
"The GUI sucks!" - NO IT DOESN'T. "Uh huh yes it does, it takes forever to do anything.." - I DON'T WANT YOU IN EVE! Gee. Why don't players stay.. it's not your fault though. It's CCP's. They run this ship, not the people who play it.
Hyperbole does not make your basic point any less false.
If someone tells me the UI sucks, and I offer them the "Fix your overview" youtube video, then they tell me to get stuffed and keep on crying about it anyway...
Not only were those sorry excuses for gamers unlikely to keep playing anyway because the game doesn't wipe your ass for you, but they are also the kind of person I never want to play any game with.
So it's good if those kind of people quit. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6398
|
Posted - 2014.05.19 18:41:00 -
[37] - Quote
epicurus ataraxia wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:DrSmegma wrote: This isn't about "refuting". You can't keep players by "refuting" their points. That's why people don't stick. If CCP had surveys, they'd show that. But the lack of surveys already shows the next issue that caused all 3 of the previous ones: CCP don't give a **** about player retention.
You know something? If they are the kind of "player" who won't tolerate being "refuted" (also known as being called out when they are bullshitting), then I don't want them in EVE. In fact I make it my business to actively chase such people away. So if you come into my game 2 hours old and start spouting off about how things should be? You and your mediocre opinion can go jump in a lake. Example in point. Does not want others to play in his game. Gets them to leave. Way to go!
You're welcome. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6400
|
Posted - 2014.05.19 20:05:00 -
[38] - Quote
Eurydia Vespasian wrote:Oh, lookit! It's one of these threads that people disagree about stuff.
No it's not! "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6424
|
Posted - 2014.05.20 20:25:00 -
[39] - Quote
Galen Darksmith wrote: The sad thing is, this has happened before. UO and Trammel, SWG and the NGE, niche MMOs have tried to go mainstream before. The results were disasterous for said games, and would be here as well.
Of course, the people complaining don't care. They're under the delusion that pretend scams, thefts, and ganks make you a sociopath IRL, and would rather see EVE destroyed than continue as it has for over a decade.
Trammel is a dirty word for more than just what it stood for in UO, what's more.
Trammel means restriction, deprive of freedom. It is a vile, contemptible word, and anyone who would visit that upon another should be looked upon with contempt themselves. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6437
|
Posted - 2014.05.21 16:13:00 -
[40] - Quote
SurrenderMonkey wrote:Vivec Septim wrote:Sentamon wrote:Here's a better question, why isn't EVE dead like just about every other 10 year old MMO?
Rippard and his followers need to put an end to his crusade of making this game a WoW in space or dead, like just about every other MMO besides WoW, is exactly what you'll get. Not everyone who wants more engaging PvE wants "WoW in Space". Quit straw manning the position. The conflating of NPE/new player retention and PvE is dumb, and has been dumb since the OP. They're two completely distinct subjects which really have nothing to do with each other.
Nevermind that people who talk about "better PVE" invariably ARE talking about Wow in Space. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
|
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6438
|
Posted - 2014.05.21 16:16:00 -
[41] - Quote
Vivec Septim wrote: Again, PvE is only dumb if no effort is made to keep it fresh. I've put some ideas forward which is more than just "PvE is dumb, it should be ignored/removed"
You don't seem to get it yet.
Shooting red crosses will never be "fresh". It will always be shooting red crosses, because the computing power needed to make their AI anything but the incredibly binary behavior it is now would be a massive drain on the game's servers.
Nevermind that CCP has tried updating their AI within their means before, and guess what? Players figured it out after a month, and then people like you cried for more.
Just. Like. Wow.
You want CCP to exist to create content for you to consume. The real EVE players, on the other hand, realize what a sandbox is, and are playing in one. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6438
|
Posted - 2014.05.21 16:27:00 -
[42] - Quote
Vivec Septim wrote: Not enough points of similarity between the two games or arguments. Thus your point is a straw man -- i.e. building up a separate argument to stand in for the argument or position of your opponent and arguing against that point, rather than the point the original person is putting forth.
False. I quantified the statement. Because you want CCP to keep creating new content for you to consume, as opposed to playing in the sandbox. You want a themepark game, not a real one.
Quote:
I play EVE, not WoW.
Despite the best efforts of people like you and Ripard Teg, that is still true.
Quote: I see potential in more engaging PvE. It is only a matter of investment in time and resources to make it happen.
I do not dislike those who do PvP and think they should have the freedom to do so as they wish;
I see zero potential in a vague generality without any substance to back it up. When people say "more engaging PvE", you're not acutally saying anything, you're just being as vague as possible. If you want to actually talk about it, then come up with some concrete ideas instead of just spouting off about how you don't think carebear playstyles are treated seriously.
If you actually have any ideas of just saying "do it CCP!", then let's hear them.
Quote: I also believe that those who want more or varied PvE should have additional content created as well.
Create your own content. That's how a sandbox works. It's what everyone else does, what's your excuse? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6442
|
Posted - 2014.05.21 17:48:00 -
[43] - Quote
Galen Darksmith wrote: Coming into EVE and expecting CCP to spoon feed you content is like me going over to WoW and expecting to be able to build a house, surround it with traps, and prey on Alliance and Horde travelers alike as some sort of bandit king. Which would be frickin' awesome, but I can't do it because games like WoW are geared towards people with no imagination who would rather grind "PvE Encounter #687" than actually think of something themselves.
Not to mention the fact that if you tried to do that in WoW, and went on to their forums complaining that you couldn't, you would be told that you were playing the wrong game. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6444
|
Posted - 2014.05.21 19:16:00 -
[44] - Quote
Galen Darksmith wrote:Bagrat Skalski wrote:Well, lets say not many players are good in creating content generally, or they create content thad do not fit nicely in EVE like fanarts or Fanfiction (who cares about it seriously). Most people will expect something to consume because they thought they pay for it. That fits into SurrenderMonkey's very apt analogy: just because someone bought a notebook and thought they were paying for a novel doesn't change that what they actually bought was a notebook. The mistake is on them alone, and demanding that the notebook be changed into a novel to suit their preconceptions on what a collection of paper pages MUST be is hilariously wrong.
Hilariously wrong and unbelievably entitled. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6446
|
Posted - 2014.05.21 20:33:00 -
[45] - Quote
Vivec Septim wrote: Lets have some more features roll out for those who enjoy a more peaceful co-existence with others (while still retaining the freedom to cause chaos on whatever scale they wish)
Those two things are mutually incompatible. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6456
|
Posted - 2014.05.21 22:41:00 -
[46] - Quote
Galen Darksmith wrote:It was happening from the very beginning. And I've had people actually join the game because of minerbumping. Everyone's run into that one douchebag online who, for whatever reason, threatens your RL person, family, pets, etc. Reading minerbumping and seeing that those sorts are generally considered the amusingly impotent bottom of the food chain in EVE has sold a few people that I know.
Quoted for truth.
My youngest brother recently became an avid reader of minerbumping, and while he doesn't play the game at all right now, I am pretty sure once he's no longer unemployed I can get him to sub.
That's content. That's how you hook new players.
Not shooting red crosses, no matter how much you try to give it a facelift and some mascara. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6457
|
Posted - 2014.05.22 12:39:00 -
[47] - Quote
Turdas Tundra wrote: Good job I guess, shame we still have the issue with no newbies wanting to touch the game.
Going back to the original point, PVE is lame.... Going into PVP with a T1 Frig or Cruiser with under 10 mil SP or being a meatshield drone is not going to impress new players. The only advantage of these ships is the fact they cost nothing and that is it, everybody knows that.
If you think that's true, then you need to stop flying with people who suck at EVE. With the exception of Battlecruisers, the T1 ship lineup has never been stronger or more competitive. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6458
|
Posted - 2014.05.22 12:48:00 -
[48] - Quote
Turdas Tundra wrote: If you want to say that the EVE game currently is fine and that to blame is new players then that is fine (really, it is) but then you need to accept that nobody new is going to touch the game.
I trained two brand new players how to setup contracts last week.
So I guess what you just said is a lie. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6459
|
Posted - 2014.05.22 13:21:00 -
[49] - Quote
Turdas Tundra wrote: So you are happy with the number of new players in EVE currently?
Yes.
Quote: Perhaps I was wrong... What's the point of this thread again?
The point of this thread is that Ripard Teg thinks that if he can muddle the issue of new player retention sufficiently, he can succeed in his efforts to turn EVE into a themepark MMO.
Quote: Did I dream the age old issue of attracting new players to EVE and the fact that the universe has 19k players online at the moment?
Yep. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6463
|
Posted - 2014.05.22 15:30:00 -
[50] - Quote
Turdas Tundra wrote: As much as beginner pvp guides on the internet can teach you I guess. But say a veteran made a new account and after a week, got in a Rifter and fought an equally skilled (player skill) AF pilot. Would it be a fair fight?
Should it be? "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
|
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6465
|
Posted - 2014.05.22 15:41:00 -
[51] - Quote
Turdas Tundra wrote:[ I'm not sure this would fix the problem when the community and game is so hostile to new players. The elitist attitude I've seen in this game is absurd.
I genuinely don't understand where you're getting this from. The community in game is one of the most helpful and friendly I have ever seen or heard of.
I've seen people get blown up, explain they were a noob, ask for assistance and been showered with isk by half the people in local. I've given out isk to more than a few new players as well.
Sure, if you cry and whine about things they will fall on you like the Sword of Damocles, but that is because you have demonstrated a poor attitude, which is to be punished.
Quote: No
So for god sake stop claiming that it is a fair fight and SP doesn't matter.
The two are different things. That's not a fair fight, but skillpoints aren't everything. They are not the defining factor in success in EVE. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6465
|
Posted - 2014.05.22 15:42:00 -
[52] - Quote
Ramona McCandless wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Turdas Tundra wrote: As much as beginner pvp guides on the internet can teach you I guess. But say a veteran made a new account and after a week, got in a Rifter and fought an equally skilled (player skill) AF pilot. Would it be a fair fight?
Should it be? Yeah, I mean why should it be? That AF costs 33mil and that T1 is 500,000isk. BUT Ive seen an Iteron kill a Falcon
There is a guy in my alliance who specializes in killing Tornados with exploration frigates. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6466
|
Posted - 2014.05.22 15:52:00 -
[53] - Quote
Ramona McCandless wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
There is a guy in my alliance who specializes in killing Tornados with exploration frigates.
I like to launch Scorch Bombs into Nullsec gate camps because its funny
Never not bomb blues. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6472
|
Posted - 2014.05.22 16:04:00 -
[54] - Quote
SurrenderMonkey wrote: At what point did it actually become "unfair"?
When you install EVE.
The only such thing as a fair fight is when one or both parties screwed up badly.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6481
|
Posted - 2014.05.22 21:30:00 -
[55] - Quote
Hey guys, why isn't licorice more popular?
Almost everybody hates it, but the people who do like it swear by it. We should make licorice more like every other candy out there, that way the people who do like it right now won't anymore, and "the rest of us" can have it, even though we already have every other kind of candy. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6490
|
Posted - 2014.05.23 15:11:00 -
[56] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Sibyyl wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Hey guys, why isn't licorice more popular?
Almost everybody hates it, but the people who do like it swear by it. We should make licorice more like every other candy out there, that way the people who do like it right now won't anymore, and "the rest of us" can have it, even though we already have every other kind of candy. Well what really irks people is that EVE isn't just licorice.. it's black licorice. Militant voice: Why the Licorice gotta be Black? And why no mention of oppressive White Licorice tryin to hold a man down (with diabeetus) /Militant voice.
Once again, my friend, you have caused me to have to clean off my monitor.
But I do agree, this thread needs more Wilford Brimley. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6492
|
Posted - 2014.05.23 16:01:00 -
[57] - Quote
Neutrino Sunset wrote:That there are workarounds does not negate my actual point, which is that ship controls in Eve are woeful (actually worse than any other game I can recall).
It's not a flight simulator. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6620
|
Posted - 2014.06.01 02:36:00 -
[58] - Quote
Don't necro threads. This thread was finally resting in peace. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
Kaarous Aldurald
ROC Deep Space The ROC
6620
|
Posted - 2014.06.01 02:39:00 -
[59] - Quote
Vivec Septim wrote:That would be on Offbeat. I just responded lol.
Nor was my post directed at you. It just registered with the forum way after I posted it for some reason. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
Psychotic Monk for CSM9. |
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